Not buying into the 'green' movement
Realtor Notebook
By Teresa Boardman, Thursday, May 8, 2008.Editor's note: Inman News would like to introduce the first column in what will be a regular series from well-known real estate blogger and real estate broker Teresa Boardman.
I hate to admit it but I am old enough to remember the very first Earth Day. It was kind of a new idea, a huge grassroots movement to protest what was going on with the environment and to educate the general public on environmental issues, like air and water quality. These days, being "green" is all the rage again, but much of it doesn't make sense to me anymore.
There is an advertisement on television for bottled water that is better for the environment because the plastic bottle, a petroleum-based product, is thinner and has less plastic in it. It seems to me that filtered tap water from the kitchen sink poured into a travel tumbler would leave a smaller carbon footprint. Why is a plastic bottle being advertised as "green" when the bottle is not needed in the first place? To sell water of course.
There are green builders too. They build using materials and methods that are kinder to the environment, and design buildings and homes that consume less energy. They should be applauded for doing so. There is another way to look at it though. In my market area there are many vacant homes in need of repair. I am no expert but it seems that if we recycled existing homes instead of building new homes there would be less of an environmental impact. It would also be better for the already established neighborhoods to have people living in every home and they might be more affordable for first-time home buyers who are still in danger of being priced out of the market.
Homes are getting larger all the time. In the '70s, families of five managed to live in 1,200-square-foot, three-bedroom ramblers. Today, the same-sized family will want at least 2,000 square feet and four bedrooms. If the home is "green" and is twice as big as the homes of yesterday does it help the environment? What about the size of the yard and all that grass that is mowed and fertilized? Does anyone ever consider the environmental impact of ornamental grass lawn?
There are green Realtors, too, who specialize in green housing. They drive large vehicles great distances to show those houses. We all know that there is a tax deduction for small businesses that buy large vehicles. Most of us spend a lot of time on the road and for most of those miles we are in the car alone. It is possible to use a smaller, more fuel-efficient car for day-to-day business and then to rent a larger vehicle for those times when more room is needed for clients. Lower fuel costs may add up to as much as the tax deduction for a large vehicle and the cost of renting a vehicle for business is also a tax deduction.
Has being "green" caught on, or is it just a marketing gimmick? Last year, the local news media called me and wanted to talk to my home buyer clients who had decided to purchase homes that are closer to where they work because of the high price of gasoline. None of my buyers at the time were concerned enough about gasoline prices to give up the dream of a larger home on a larger lot in the suburbs. The American Dream is about consumption -- not conservation -- and will remain so until we run out of choices.
I am not a "green" Realtor, which is nice because I don't have to drive somewhere to buy bottled water, or purchase a more energy-efficient home in the 'burbs. I am not buying into the green movement either; it just doesn't make sense. I am a small-business owner who is always looking at my bottom line, and who remembers the very first Earth Day. Reducing my own carbon footprint translates into higher profits.
Teresa Boardman is a broker in St. Paul, Minn., and founder of the St. Paul Real Estate blog.
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Submitted by Bob Carney on May 8, 2008 - 4:48am.
Nice job T. Yes, I feel it is the right thing to do. However; I do believe it is only a gimmick in marketing.
Bob Carney
Frederick, MD
REALTOR
http://FocusOnFrederick.com
Submitted by Missy Caulk on May 8, 2008 - 4:48am.
I'm not green either, but there is lots of chatter about it in Ann Arbor. Some builders are starting to use the term more and more. I do see buyers wanting to buy closer to work due to gas.
Missy Caulk
Ann Arbor, MI
Missy@MissyCaulk.com
www.AnnArborRealEstateTalk.com
www.SearchAnnArborHouses.com
Submitted by Maureen Francis on May 8, 2008 - 4:52am.
Having lived in Eastern Europe long before the green movement hit here, I learned about being green from people who do it as a way of life, not because of marketing.
They bought food in glass and metal containers. Not plastic, styrofoam or any petrochemical.
They used public transport to get everywhere.
They washed and reused plastic bags for groceries until the bag fell apart.
I live in metro Detroit. When the auto companies were working on alternative fuel cars nobody wanted them. Gas was cheap. I will reduce my carbon footprint by driving my big ol' gas chugging caddy for a while longer. It has low miles, its paid off and I barely drive 10k miles a year in it. Buying a Prius for better mileage hardly makes sense (and it would not go over too well here anyway...)
Submitted by Christi Borden, CIPS, ABR, GRI on May 8, 2008 - 5:22am.
The green movement is starting to appear in our area, but Houston, TX is a place where we LOVE our cars and trucks and our traffic jams prove it. While I recycle what I can, conserve where feasible, it would be a bit disingenuous of me to market myself as a Green Realtor while driving my clients around town in my big Sequoia.
Your Katy, TX Realtor,
Christi Borden, CIPS, GRI, ABR
Prudential Gary Greene, Realtors
Email: Christi@ChristiBorden.com
Web: www.ChristiBorden.com
Cell: 832-372-7470
Submitted by Mack Perry on May 8, 2008 - 5:25am.
In Atlanta the home builders association has adopted a green program called Earthcraft Home. Yes there are energy efficiency standards for these new homes but most of them are huge, 3,000 sf plus. You make an excellent point that we all survived in much smaller homes in the 70's than we do now.
Is downsizing a part of the "Green Movement"?
Submitted by Susan Krancer on May 8, 2008 - 5:25am.
Lots of "green" talk here by the builders as well. But they use "green" at their convenience, they aren't committed to it.
Susan Krancer
REALTOR®
Liz Moore & Associates
Williamsburg, VA 23188
www.WilliamsburgGolfProperties.com
Submitted by Barbara Hunter on May 8, 2008 - 5:27am.
Hi, Teresa
I totally agree with you about rehabbing existing homes and am proud to say that a lot of that is already going on in older segments of Nashville where I live and work.
Our new mayor, Karl Dean, also is supportive of environmentally friendly projects, and a mixed-use development was just completed in the downtown area that will provide housing at all income levels so those at the lower end will not be totally displaced. The developers of that project formed a non-profit for these type projects.
I recently attended a meeting of "Go Green Nashville" which is a local, grassroots movement. One attendee purchased a large home in the 'burbs three years ago...before she was aware of the impact it has on the environment. She said it's not feasible to move, so now that she is aware she is doing whatever she can to make her home more environmentally friendly.
I think being "true green" has to do with education, education, education, and shifting consciousness. I'm going to volunteer with Go Green Nashville and see where I can help.
I have a lot more to say on this subject, but I'll stop now!
Barbara Hunter, Realtor
Nashville, TN
www.greenre-creations.blogspot.com
Submitted by Karen Rice on May 8, 2008 - 5:37am.
T,
**applause**
**applause**
I am all for conservation. Really I am. I don't buy stuff because it SAYS it's green.
I also don't believe Al Gore - I challenge anyone who thinks he's a champion for the environment to go to Snopes and look up his house vs. George Bush's house - who lives "greener"?
There is "green talk" or "green marketing" and there is true "green living." I really resent how stupid these companies think people are - and on the other hand, I really resent how stupid sheeple can be....
Karen Rice
Northeast PA / Lake Wallenpaupack Real Estate Agent
Pike Wayne PA Real Estate Info
Submitted by Stephanie Edwards-Musa on May 8, 2008 - 5:41am.
Hi Theresa,
The thing is, there is the green movement and then there is the green building movement. They are two totally different things. Green building and remodeling is designed for the homeowner more than the environment...but with the environment in mind.
As gas prices, the rate of cancer and other auto-immune disorders such as allergies and asthma rise in numbers, more and more people will want to go green with their home. IMO, it will start with what people will see in new construction and filter down to rehabbing homes and areas. It has already started here in huge numbers.
The systems used to build are different and go against the grain of past ways. If Real Estate Agents do not catch on, homebuyers will have no idea whether what they are buying is green or a marketing gimmick. It's very complex.
Stephanie Edwards-Musa
Submitted by Dena Calivas on May 8, 2008 - 6:03am.
I invite each of you to go to websites such as http://www.Earthlab.com and http://www.greenhomeguide.org/features/45_ways_to_green_the_not_so_new_h.... There are dozens of ideas that each of us can do to make a difference in energy and water conservation and still have our comfort and save money. It is not going to happen over night, but we can each make contributions.
I do agree that many advertisers take advantage of the "Green" terminology. Al Gore did birng up some good points; however, we should all learn to walk the talk. He certainly needs to make changes at his home. We all can!! There are many people out there that are making contributions that do make a difference. We can all learn to live more eco-friendly.
Dena M. Calivas, P.A.
REALTOR® Associate/GRI, e-PRO, IRES
EcoBroker® Certified-Jacksonville's First and Only!
904-759-3990 Cell
http://www.GreenUpJax.com
http://realtytimes.com/reuv/DenaMCalivas -Real Estate News
Awarded FIVE STAR " Best in Client Satisfaction" Real Estate Agent 2005-2008!
Distinguished Realty
150 Warren Circle
St. Johns FL 32259
Submitted by Karl Lingenfelder on May 8, 2008 - 6:38am.
Right on, Teresa, one has to be careful how one does "Green" and many of us have lived "Green" all our lives. That plastic bottle also ends up in a landfill. Moving closer to work makes life easier and leaves one with more free time and less stress. Shopping is more convenient too. Large homes may be nice, but they can also be a big chore; even with help.
One begins living "Green" by cutting out unnecessary consumption. Do we really need to buy all that stuff?
Karl Lingenfelder
President/CEO
www.viewr.com
karl@viewr.com
Submitted by Lauren Everingham on May 8, 2008 - 6:49am.
It seems you are referring more to the Green marketing movement, rather than the green movement. I completely agree that it's silly and utterly counterproductive to make something a little less bad for the environment and then slap a "Green" label on it and pretend it's good for the environment. As others on here have said, if we really want to be green we need to stop buying so much stuff. The real green movement is being led by people who re-use and recycle, who ride a bike instead of driving a car, who compost and grow their own vegetables, and so on. It's not being led by corporations, and it never will be, because they depend on consumption for their survival.
Lauren Everingham
Century 21 All Seasons
www.c21allseasons.com
Submitted by Kristal Kraft on May 8, 2008 - 7:18am.
Good Points you bring up T! I'm always amazed at what "marketing" can do to our minds! In the name of profit we at fed a ton of bull. Many times it actually works so Madison Ave. still does it.
I would just like to see common sense return, in the form of actual "common sense."
Welcome to Inman! You are a swell addition!
Kristal Kraft
Selling Denver Real Estate
Submitted by Teresa Boardman on May 8, 2008 - 7:27am.
Stephanie - I like what you are saying and was going to include the idea that we can set a good example and we can also mention to buyers the idea that living close to work cuts down on the amount of toxins poured into the air each day.
Submitted by Elizabeth Weintraub on May 8, 2008 - 7:43am.
Hey T -
You have touched upon an important issue. I say: "Making your home green sounds like an excellent idea, and in many ways, green homes appear to be a step individuals can take to help fight global warming. But when you dig deeper, you may begin to realize that consumerism has pushed its way into the greening movement to such an extent that it's difficult to figure out whether many of the so-called eco-friendly products are helping to protect the environment or if manufacturers have developed clever marketing ploys that mislead consumers."
Elizabeth Weintraub
Broker-Associate
Sacramento
http://elizabethweintraub.com
Submitted by Marc Grossman on May 8, 2008 - 8:10am.
I believe in being 'green.' We need to care and be concerned of our environment. It's the only one that we have. I too remember Earth Days from the '70's. What you're written is so correct. The sad part is that what's talked about being 'green' nowadays is more marketing ploy and than anything else.
Submitted by Marianne Yates on May 8, 2008 - 11:22am.
I completely agree that the majority of the "green" movement is marketing fluff, and those companies should be ashamed. However, if the green bandwagon means that just a few more people are now more aware of what a carbon footprint even is, that's better than nothing isn't it?
Submitted by Matt Carter on May 8, 2008 - 12:07pm.
Green building practices and environmentally-friendly developments probably won't take off in a big way until
A) There are obvious economic benefits for consumers
B) The public (and politicians) give planners the powers they need to make it happen.
I used to cover an affluent city east of San Francisco, Pleasanton, where residents routinely opposed any high density housing project developers brought to the city. As a result, a ton of McMansions got built on huge lots, often on land that used to be ranches or farms.
Pleasanton sits at the end of the Bay Area's awesome regional train line, BART. While property owners wanted approval to do mixed-use, high-density housing near the BART stop -- a plan environmental groups were behind -- residents were afraid of impacts on traffic and schools.
During the boom, with places like Pleasanton running out of room to develop and resisting high density housing, developers built a lot of housing on farmland in places like Tracy -- 60 or 90 miles away from job centers and without easy access to public transit. Now those newly-built communities are some of the hardest hit by the housing downturn.
You can't blame people in places like Pleasanton for wanting to preserve what they've got, but there is often little logic and tremendous waste in the way development takes place in many parts of the country.
Does it matter?
Here are some statistics I noted last year when writing about a proposal by Michigan Democrat John Dingell to cut greenhouse gas emissions by raising gasoline taxes by 50 cents per gallon and eliminating the mortgage interest tax deduction for homes 3,000 square feet and up (If that sounded far-fetched last year, imagine how it would go over right now!). From my post, which has links to statistics cited:
"The National Association of Home Builders predicts that while average home size will remain around 2,400 square feet for the next decade, the typical "upscale" home will be 4,000 square feet by 2015. According to the U.S. EPA, the energy we use heating, cooling and lighting our homes (and running all those appliances) accounts for close to 17 percent of total U.S. greenhouse gas emissions."
Submitted by TitleRep on May 8, 2008 - 1:30pm.
"Green" is big here in Portland(imagine that).
We have the Earth Advantage organization that provides education to builders/Realtors and consumers. They also provide the certifications for new construction and remodels for energy efficiency and all that green stuff.
Every little bit helps and it'll catch on eventually. Lets just hope the waters don't get muddied by those claiming to be green that really aren't.
Oh, and way to go TB on your first column for Inman!
-Jeff
Submitted by Brett Young on May 8, 2008 - 3:58pm.
Teresa,
You're right that there can be a marked difference between professing to be Green and actually living a Green lifestyle. The Green movement is very strong here in New Paltz, NY. Fortunately, there are many here that back their words with actions.
Brett Young
High Ground Realty
New Paltz Real Estate
Submitted by Kevin Doell on May 8, 2008 - 5:24pm.
Teresa,
What if we just called it the "Greener Movement?"
With that slight adjustment to the label, we could all feel a little less pressure to be perfect.
"Green" is one of those things that is so highly susceptible to criticism because of the ubiquitous nature of the issue.
What's important is progress and if it takes a marketing buzzword to move the needle a bit and to raise our culture's collective consciousness on this critical issue, then so be it. (see: http://bhgrealestateblog.com/tugging-on-the-green-center.html)
What I would hate to see would be if cynicism over "green wash" gripped our society and suddenly snuffed out the seeds of awareness that all these billions of marketing dollars have sown.
Every step we take to be "greener" is an improvement, and every step should be welcome.
Thanks for starting this important thread.
Kevin @ bhgrealestateblog.com
Submitted by Pensacola Realtor Robin Sherman on May 8, 2008 - 6:57pm.
Teresa - As a broker who has just completed the EcoBroker certification and who also remembers the first Earth Day, I have to say that cynicism seems to be as in vogue as is going green. If only we had jumped on board back in the 70s and actually done something . . . but, I have to believe it's not too late.
In my market there is no real advantage to using "green" as a marketing tool. There is still very little interest. (Evidenced by our recent grade of F for air quality, very worst county in the state.) The majority of the people here are more concerned with putting food on the table given the low wages and high level of poverty. However, I have taken the initiative to put both the time and money into the EcoBroker course work and certification. I know that the education will help my clients and I know that it has already helped me in my personal quest to reduce my consumption and environmental impact, that of my family and my business. If there's a business or marketing benefit, well . . . good for me. I applaud anyone who chooses to learn.
I say, whatever it takes.
Submitted by michelle bruhn on May 9, 2008 - 7:39am.
Hi Teresa,
It has been over a year since I commented on a blog posting of yours... I work at your local builders association-(BATC) and needed to get in my 3 cents (blame that # on inflation) as someone working with both new home builders and remodelers, and a real estate license holder...
I respect your position, and agree that there is so much noise about green right now, that it has created its own type of pollution. I also respect the family that wants to move out to the burbs, the retired couple who wants move into association maintained townhomes, and the newlyweds who want to fix up a great old downtown gem. That ties in with my first cent: 'green' has to mean different things to different people- we can't all live in the city condos, bike to work and eat from our organic roof top gardens- just like we can't all live in suburban McMansions on acre lots. This gets into lifestyle choice- and at least people are becoming aware of their options through all the green marketing going on...penny #2: Lots of people in our Twin Cities are interested in what they can do to live green, and we are excited if that includes the home they live in. One of the earlier comments to your post made a great point re: green movement in general versus green building - different focuses but 100% interconnected. Green building looks at carbon footprints, indoor air quality, energy rates appliances and how homeowners can LIVE a greener life. On that note, The Builders Association of the Twin Cities (BATC) along with the Minnesota Pollution Control Agency,and other local organizations has created MN GreenStar (www.mngreenstar.org/). "a program that promotes healthy and sustainable building practice that are economically advantageous and socially desirable." This program, with third party verification on different levels of building environmentally friendly homes, is designed around MN's extreme climate as a way for home owners to have a say in how their home is built or remodeled. This effort has both remodeling and new home programs. I heard you loud and clear that you are not buying the green thing, but how are you helping your clients if you simply turn a blind eye to the new practices, materials and technologies in the building industry, which, let's face it had to build at some point so you can sell it. If you are still reading, my third penny is going into an education fund for builders and realtors alike, because the industry as a whole should be able to educate their clients on real options, and not just the gimmicks. I invite you to sit in on a MN Greenstar training session and see if what we are doing is selling a thinner plastic home, or educating builders and realtors on what the local community has been asking for.
Way to go on making it onto Inman, your first article did exactly what it was supposed to- get people thinking enough to write in- thanks!
- michelle @ batc
Submitted by Matt Carter on May 9, 2008 - 9:36am.
The U.S. Green Building Council has created Leadership in Energy and Environmental Design (LEED) rating standards that local governments can adopt if they want to ensure that developers and builders are using the latest green building techniques. There are varying levels of compliance to give cities flexibility in how tough they want to be. If I recall correctly, Pleasanton was requiring commercial projects to meet an intermediate LEED rating standard and was looking at applying the standards to new residential developments.
Submitted by Brad Coy on May 9, 2008 - 12:40pm.
Hey T,
Congrats on your first post at Inman. Great discussion.
>Kevin Doel. I echo your thoughts here: "What I would hate to see would be if cynicism over "green wash" gripped our society and suddenly snuffed out the seeds of awareness that all these billions of marketing dollars have sown".
I've grown a bit weary of the "movement" myself. But it's easy to just brush these issues off as being cliche' and let's move on to the next one. Especially when our environment and culture keeps putting the issue right in our faces.
If we, as consumers were not standing up to big corporations, the marketing side would be non-existent. The important measure will be where do they take a stance when it comes to their practices as businesses. Our individuals efforts are null and void if they don't put their money where their mouths are.
Brad Coy
Realtor/VP at San Francisco Real Estate Services
*EcoBroker
Submitted by Katrine 'Trinkie" Watson on May 9, 2008 - 7:59pm.
Hi Teresa:
Very refreshing commentary! If most of us would just pay attention to waste disposal and recycling, products we use on a daily basis and maybe rethink the type of car we buy next time (as more eco-friendly cars are made that fill the needs we have), a lot will be accomplished. My hat is off to the earth people who grow their own produce, bike everywhere and spend frugally. I am working on the spending part...the veggie growing and biking to work will never happen.
Yes, we accumulate far too much stuff and realize just how much when we ask ourselves what we haven't used in the last year. It's amazing what we can part with and never miss. I still have the folding steam iron that does sheets, etc. that I ordered before Christmas sitting in the box in my closet. I REALLY needed that.
That we are becoming more aware of utility and caring for the planet is a good thing. Downsizing our dwellings probably makes a lot of sense, and recycling houses is fabulous, especially when they have character and good bones. As prices of land and property in pretty places escalates, old style homes just don't cut it. We have lost many of our charming Old Tahoe cabins on the lake as they sell for millions and are no longer acceptable in their current state. I guess the up side is providing jobs to maintain the new homes and landscaping along with ancillary home and entertainment services.
I do see many with big properties who are excellent stewards. It's the person in the car in front of me who tosses a soda can out the window that I find hard to believe!
Write more.....
Trinkie Watson
Chase International
Regional Lake Tahoe Broker
Submitted by Susie Blackmon on May 10, 2008 - 2:03am.
Happy to see others questioning all the 'green' media. I too feel it is 'gimmicky' especially when applied to a home with exorbitant square footage. We continue to have more babies than we need. However, we are doing lots of good things; such as recycling, reusable grocery bags, etc.
Susie Blackmon
http://www.BuckingtheRealEstateTrend.com
Submitted by Bonnie Erickson on May 12, 2008 - 1:41pm.
Interesting indeed. My daughter did a paper on bottled water and the results were downright scary, not only in their impact on the environment but on the harmful chemicals that leech into the water we're all paying large dollars to consume every day! I think I'll refill my old glass bottles, thank you! I know only a few truly "green" practitioners. They buy clothes at the re-use centers. They recycle so much that they only have one bag of disposable garbage a month. They have balls of string and rubber bands in their drawers, plastic bags drying on the clothesline, foil carefully washed and flattened for reuse, don't remove broken cement blocks unearthed in gardens, ride public transit or bikes EVERYWHERE, and keep their homes so cold that they need to wear fur coats which annoys the animal rights activists. My grandparents were models of green-ness because they survived the depression. Consumerism has drastically impacted green-ness. I'm not a green radical. I do my little part, but I won't buy a Prius!
Submitted by Francene Grewe on May 12, 2008 - 2:33pm.
The National Trust for Historic Preservation's Sustainable Stewardship of our Buildings and Communities - Guiding Principles:
Reuse existing buildings: Use what you have. The continued use of our existing buildings reduces the amount of demolition and construction waste deposited in landfills, lessens unnecessary demand for energy and other natural resources and conserves embodied energy (the amount of energy originally expended to create extant structures).
Reinvest in our older and historic communities: Older and historic communities tend to be centrally located, dense, walkable, and are often mass-transit accessible – qualities celebrated and promoted by Smart Growth advocates. Reinvestment in existing communities also preserves the energy embedded in infrastructure, such as roads, water and sewer lines.
Retrofit our existing building stock: Many historic and older buildings are remarkably energy efficient because of their site sensitivity, quality of construction, and use of passive heating and cooling, while other buildings require improvements to reduce their environmental footprint. Historic buildings can go green without compromising historic character.
Submitted by Joy Canova on May 13, 2008 - 9:12pm.
There are standards for building green. As in all marketing, one must use critical thinking skills to discover the hype from the real. There are also companies who work to rehab houses to green standards -- yes it can be done. And to be done in the highest LEED certification, size is a great consideration. Get informed. It is an inevitable movement with real life pay off.
Submitted by Anthony Longo on May 16, 2008 - 6:02am.
Hey Teresa!!!
I have a link that may change your mind. "The Greening of Southie" which is a documentary on the building from ground up of a luxury condominium development here in Boston that obtained Gold Level LEED ratings...its quite amazing.
Trailer here: http://boston.condodomain.com/blog/the-greening-of-southie/
PS: If you have Comcast Cable out that way, go on to OnDemand and watch it under Documentaries.
Anthony Longo
Founder & CEO, CondoDomain.com
Visit the all new http://Boston.CondoDomain.com
Submitted by Jim Duncan on May 20, 2008 - 4:14am.
Late to the party ...
Teresa -
I think that relatively few people will "go green" for the "right" (environmental) reasons. But if they can save a few bucks here and there by making smarter buying decisions - and those happen to be "green" then they will.
There are all sorts of greening options on new houses and rehabs that make financial sense - better insulation (save on heating and cooling), instant water heater (save on power), sustainable flooring, better design to take advantage of the sun - relatively simple things that can directly impact the consumers' bottom line.
Will the majority go green for the environment? Doubtful. Will they do it to save 20-100-1000 bucks? I think so.
Jim Duncan
434-242-7140
http://www.realcentralva.com
Realtor/Blogger